Five Myths About BICSI Conferences - Debunked!

We bust five myths about BICSI conferences with concrete tactics for first-timers, field techs, and designers. From committee work to exhibit hall strategy, we show how to translate networking and standards into real jobsite wins and long-term career growth.

• conferences not just for designers, clear entry points for technicians
• why first-timers session and BICSI Village matter
• how to sit in on committees and add field insight
• planning your agenda with the app for ROI
• vendor agnostic talks and value of keynotes
• exhibit hall strategy to solve real problems
• networking tactics for introverts
• building a living library of standards and best practice
• career lift stories and mentoring mindsets
• educate clients rather than sell features

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If you find value in this content, would you click on that QR code right there? You can buy me a cup of coffee. You can even schedule a 15-minute one-on-one call with me after hours, of course.

Chapters

• 0:00 Welcome, Subscribe, And Live Streams
• 2:47 Recording From BICSI And Guest Intro
• 4:16 Myth 1: Conferences Are Only For Designers
• 8:48 Finding Committees And Where Newcomers Fit
• 13:20 Why Volunteer: Passing Knowledge Forward
• 17:24 Field Voices Needed In Standards Work
• 20:12 Myth 2: Too Expensive, No ROI
• 25:36 Exhibit Hall As A Problem Solver
• 31:52 Myth 3: It’s All Sales Pitches

Transcript

SPEAKER_02: 0:31

Welcome to the show where we tackle the tough questions submitted by apprentices, installers, technicians, foreman, project managers, estimators, IT customers, even everybody. We're connecting at the human level so that we can connect the world. If you're watching this show on YouTube, would you mind hitting the subscribe button and the bell button to be notified when new content's being produced? If you're listening to us on one of the audio podcast platforms, would you mind leaving us a five-star rating? The simple little steps help us take on the algorithm so we can educate, encourage, and enrich the lives of people in the ICT industry. Wednesday nights, 6 p.m. Eastern Standard Time, what are you doing? You know I do a live stream on TikTok, Instagram, LinkedIn, YouTube, everywhere I can figure out how to send a video stream to where you get to ask your favorite RCDD questions on installation, design, project management, estimation, even career path questions. But I can hear you now. Chuck and drive him, drinking, wessy, vessel, I don't want to get anything accident. Take a breath. I record them and you can watch them at your convenience. And finally, while this show is free and will always remain free. If you find value in this content, would you click on that QR code right there? You can buy me a cup of coffee. You can even schedule a 15-minute one-on-one call with me after hours, of course. So if you haven't already figured it out, I am not in my podcast duty. I'm as Bixie Beyond 2025, recording in their podcast booth. How cool is that? As a as a 25-plus year veteran of Bixie and in volunteering and committees and all this stuff, I hear a lot of people say false things about the about because about coming to events like this. So I figured I would I would invite one of my one of my favorite RCDDs, who also happens to be a neighbor of mine. We live literally like 15 minutes apart. And the funny thing is we only see each other, it seems like we have to go to Vegas to see each other or Orlando to see each other. So I'm bringing on Chuck Wilson from Wilson Technology so we can we can address these five myths. Chuck Wilson, how you doing, my friend? Chuck, I'm glad to be here. Chuck Squid, Chuck Square, that's it. No, you're not the first time on the show because you were on in a previous episode. Help me put a uh ground rod in for the podcast today. We'll do the uh vegan. Yep, which I still have not hooked up yet. Farm life, I'm telling you, I just and yeah, just lots and lots of stuff going on. So you've been around a long time, Magaia, right? And and you probably heard these same things. So I'm gonna go through five myths. My first conference was the 94. Oh wow, you beat me by a couple years. My first one was nine, no, two thousand. So the first one I want to address is uh those pixie conferences, those are only for the designers and the RCD D Ds, right? Or R C D Ds and put one little tool too much D's in that, right? So but you set up committee meetings and volunteer groups, stuff like that. What would you what would a first time field tag do here on day one?

SPEAKER_01: 3:26

One uh uh when it's available, attend the uh Vixie first timers. You'll get a uh a feel from people who have been involved of what goes on and how everything takes place, uh, what's available to you. Um go to the uh Vixie Village. It gives you exposure to the documentation library, it gives you uh obviously Dixie Cares is important, um and uh it gives you a feel for the organization, and you'll start to meet people. Um if you're a credential holder, uh you want to go to the uh credential holders lounge. Uh the networking that takes place there is incredible, and it's not just for RCDEs, it is for technicians. Um the Orlando conference always highlights the uh skills challenge, and we've now even got international participants in the skills challenge watching that go over the years, and you see that a lot of those people now have become instructors. They are now and come back as judges, judges, yes.

SPEAKER_02: 4:42

So then and then they also go on to do volunteer work at committees and stuff like that. It's got it's almost like a launching pad, correct.

SPEAKER_01: 4:50

Uh if you have an interest in particular things, uh such as codes, standards, uh growth uh growth, uh get it get involved. Uh one of the key things is to before you attend, is to take a look at the conference uh booklet. It is also available usually online a few weeks before the conference. Plan out what you want to see. There is something for everybody in this industry at some point during the conference.

SPEAKER_02: 5:27

Yes, uh absolutely. And I did I did that with the app. I downloaded the app beforehand. Okay, and I went ahead and I selected the ones I want, and I like that because it actually pops up on my phone to remind me. It's like, oh hey, 15 minutes the PDC meeting starts. You need to go. Yeah, yeah. So I've come a long way with the app. Right, right, right. Um, so as a newcomer coming here, there's lots of committees here, you know, the the standards committees, the permit, the PDC committee, and all those others. What's a good one for a newcomer to come? Because you a lot of people don't know this. You can go to the you don't have to be a member of the committee. You can go in there and sit as an observer and watch what's going on. Correct. So, what would be a good one for a new first-timer newcomer? What would be one of those good committee meetings when they kind of sit in and well pick pick one you have an interest in and uh sit in on that committee?

SPEAKER_01: 6:14

There are some that deal with membership or some that deal with codes, and some that uh deal with various standards, but there's breakouts within the standards. So if you have an interest in healthcare, you may want to sit in on that committee as they work through the next document that's gonna be coming out. Um so find out what where your field of interest is and sit in. See if you like it. Um I've served on various committees throughout the the years.

SPEAKER_02: 6:50

So and the beautiful thing about committees is you develop lifelong relationships. Oh, have you you learn you learn things that you didn't know, and and you you don't need to know everything to volunteer for one of those committees. Exactly. You exactly you don't have to be a subject matter expert, you just have to have a passion. And exactly I was sat in I sat in several meetings yesterday, and I sat in one of yours and uh the N1, N2, and the N3, correct. High level, what is N1, N2, and N3? And you you I also want to talk about you need help, you need volunteers.

SPEAKER_01: 7:22

Oh, absolutely. It's the imparting of knowledge to the next generation, and the current generation, the current users, it's taking this brain trust because I'm not a young chicken. I know that I wish when you were like 25. I wish. Um but I know at some point I will not be other two participate. It's taking that brain trust and imparting it into documentation that is now going to be shared with the next generation of installer and designer. And to me, that is key about what we're about. Um, as you say, knowledge is power, yeah. And being able to share that knowledge and impart it to others to me is key.

SPEAKER_02: 8:10

You know, one of my in my day job uh I talk about code, standards, and best practices. And the way that always describe best practice, you know, best practice will be the TDM, the it's a manual or the practice for the and the way I always describe it is you know, it's it's a roadmap on how to do the work efficiently, correctly, that will last forever, written by people with decades of experience who are giving you this information. And my dad always used to say the best lesson learned is the one from somebody else's mistake. Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. So, what's N1, N2, N3, and uh and what kind of people are you looking for for help?

SPEAKER_01: 8:47

The M1, 2, and 3 is a section of the uh codes or standards that uh need to be updated because our industry has changed, changed tremendously in the last few years since that document was published. So periodically, all the standards are reviewed by groups, groups of people who have inputs. You don't have to be a subject matter expert on everything, but you bring your experience to a table to help us build the new document tractors. Uh because they have to be constantly updated, usually anywhere from three to four years.

SPEAKER_02: 9:29

Yeah, you need you really need, correct me if I'm wrong, you really need the help of the people who are still doing the work in the field, who are fresh out of the field, because one of the things about community members is a lot of those people are advancing their careers. Very few people on well, committee meetings are actually still out there pulling cape. Don't get me wrong, there are some, there are some, but the vast majority are people who are are designers, estimators, project managers, QA, whatever. Uh so we need more people who are still yesterday.

SPEAKER_01: 9:56

One of the uh uh participants who was sending in is now getting involved.

SPEAKER_02: 10:01

Um by TJ. TJ the the power, yeah. TJ Pay, who's also a three-time Bixie Skills Challenge winner.

SPEAKER_01: 10:09

Yeah, yeah. Uh here's the kid that started out as an installer, yep, and uh now works for one of the large power companies. And he brings an expertise that a lot of them still have because he deals with overhead optimal fiber installations. Yep.

SPEAKER_02: 10:27

Uh I was I was aware of it, but I've never been able to talk to uh someone who's actually been involved in doing see, and that's that's the that's the exact point I was just trying to make, right? So you'll like people at UNI level, we're we're aware of a lot of stuff, but we've may not necessarily have done it. That's that's why you know when you put out that call, I was like, we need to get this message out to people who are in the field. You know, you think, you know, I'm just the I'm just a technician in the field, I'm project foreman. What can I do? There's a lot of stuff you can do.

SPEAKER_01: 10:56

Oh, technicians bring a tremendous amount of insight because they're the hands-on. Uh I was fortunate. I started out as a technician with Bob Bell. Uh, and I I look back at the mentors that mentored me then at your I am so grateful for because it has advanced my career over the years. And that was before of Bixie R C D D.

SPEAKER_02: 11:24

Yep. Oh, it's cracked to me up when people, you know, they yeah, they they they feel self-conscious about not having the experience. I keep telling everybody, we all start with zero days experience in this field. Everybody starts at the same time. So let's go let's go to myth number two. Okay. It Bixie's too expensive. I don't get enough return on my investment. Right. So uh what would uh what would you say to uh what were some tips that you may give people to help maybe it's an investment in yourself, it's an investment in your company.

SPEAKER_01: 11:58

And if you're an owner of the business, it's an investment in your employees. Um what they you'll get a return on your investment in what they bring to the interface of your of your customers based on other conferences that I've gone to, it's very economical. Uh yes, the cost of conferences has gone up over the years. Well, it hasn't. Yeah. Um but the the the investment that you make because you're always exposed to something new, you're exposed with to networking with with people that you know or but that you meet, and you get to share those experiences that you don't have because of where they are. I just talked to a gentleman who's from the West Coast, he's from the Silicon Valley area. And just in general conversation, what he's exposed to and his challenges are different than my challenges in Florida. Oh, absolutely. So uh, I mean, I don't have the lightning capital of the United States. Yes. We're the lightning capital, but I don't worry about earthquakes. Right. I don't have seismic structures protection. Yes, I don't have to worry about good.

SPEAKER_02: 13:07

But California installers do. They gotta worry about seismic protection and you know the vibration and all that stuff. Exactly. And in Florida, we gotta worry about the what was it three weeks ago? We had 30,000 lightning strikes that week or something. So it uh I mean Florida gets crazy. Yes. So yeah, a management trick that I was taught to me by one of my mentors is if you're trying to justify something, make a PowerPoint slide with just three bullets to justify. You gave one already, it's an investment. What are two other things you the two other bullets you put on that slide?

SPEAKER_01: 13:36

The knowledge you you gain, whether it's from the speakers, from uh talking with others in the exhibit hall. I can't count the number of times that I've gone through the exhibit hall where a customer has created a challenge that I need to find a solution for. Oh yeah, and gone through the exhibit hall, yeah, and going, that's the solution.

SPEAKER_02: 14:03

But not only that, but it's you also have multiple solutions, right? Because you might have multiple, like let's say you're looking for a cable that might be able to go beyond 100 meters. Well, almost all the big manufacturers now have some sort of system go beyond that. So you know, you can actually go to without having to invest a whole bunch of time, you can go to this booth, that booth, and that booth, and have a good wealth of information.

SPEAKER_01: 14:25

There'll be people there that can explain. Yes, the the differences in in how their product works.

SPEAKER_02: 14:32

Yes. Oh, so it's communication is way better when it's talking as opposed to you know emails back and forth, so much gets lost in your head.

SPEAKER_01: 14:39

Well, in emails and even text. Yes. Oh so the opportunity to interface with because you get to interface with a vast array of experiences and keep you get to talk to sales, but you get to talk a lot of times manufacturers will have their engineers in the booth. Yes, they'll also have a lot of times they'll have their engineers speaking as as a right.

SPEAKER_02: 15:07

But but but they also have the engineers and they also have the salespeople. And the the benefit there is the engineers can give you the back detail, right? Correct. Um, at whatever level you need. But the salespeople, they're they deal with customers all the time. They know what are the pain points and what are the what of your customers, and that's good information to always act. Yes. What the third bullet. So the first one was knowledge, the first one was knowledge, the second one was you know, get into the boots.

SPEAKER_01: 15:33

Uh yeah, the networking, networking, the uh exposure to uh product, and the other is is big C all the conferences always have speakers that bring something new to the industry from a different perspective, they're not all within our industry. Right. Last year we had a gentleman from um the FBI or the CIA. What a fabulous, I would not have thunk. Right. I was gonna enjoy that particular presentation, but I was fascinated, and he after came back to the credentials lounge and spent almost an hour and a half, two hours just answering questions one-on-one.

SPEAKER_02: 16:17

Wow, yeah, there's there's been more than one keynote speaker, like like um, for example, the the the female um Thunderbird Pi. Oh, yeah, amazing. Awesome, amazing. And then a couple years before that, there was a guy that climbed Mount Everest. And then yeah, exactly. So, you know, so when you look at those keynote speakers and you're thinking, well, what's that have to do with ICT? I mean, it they're powerful messages that you can that the message translates across any industry, any level, you know, they're just yeah, they're they're apps absolutely. So let's go to the next uh myth number three. I don't want to go to the big chip because it's all sales pitches, it's all sales pitches. So you volunteer on the committees, right? How do you keep track of the technical so it's not so sales one as far as the committee work, even though you may come and rep work for a particular manufacturer or installation or contracting company, you have to leave that part of yourself in the suitcase.

SPEAKER_01: 17:20

You bring your expertise and your knowledge that you are sharing with, because all the committees as a member, you have to sign that you are not going to use proprietary or you're not going to just push your product in, uh, is to keep it neutral so that the information we're sharing is generic to all involved in mule genie. Uh, and I've always liked that approach. Um, and Big C staff is very on the presentations, is very diligent and going through the presentations to make sure it's not a sales touch. Yes. That that the speaker is very vendor agnostic, yes. Uh, and which is key. It's key because even though we all work for different companies, different people, we're all in the same industry. Well, and then it it's large, but it's small.

SPEAKER_02: 18:19

It's such a great business model that I mimicked it for the podcast. The podcast is vendor agnostic. You might hear me talking about fluke in one episode and softing in the next, and a. So, okay, so myth number four, I'm a newcomer, I'm gonna feel out of place. It's gonna be there with all these people who have or engineers and designers and stuff like that.

SPEAKER_01: 18:52

If you're in this business, you are not an estranger, your family. Uh almost everybody I've known in the in this organization has always been willing to share with me uh when I was questions, and it's always been open uh to meeting me. Uh I should do a show. I have never had uh somebody be hostile. I should said I was here.

SPEAKER_02: 19:24

I should do I should do a show on how to how I'm an introvert. A lot of people don't know that about me. You give me outside of this little bubble, I am an introvert. I truly am. So I should do, but I've I've learned skills from dependent mentors. I should do a show on how to approach somebody at a conference and talk to them. Because a lot, yeah, my first five, seven conferences, I would come, I would sit and did all the stuff. I wouldn't talk to nobody because I don't know how to I don't know how to have to push. Now I get it choose it being a well chatty.

SPEAKER_01: 19:56

I I have uh like in the prudential holders lounge. I'll walk up and I'll you know I asked to join a table and I'll sit there and listen for a bit.

SPEAKER_02: 20:04

Yes.

SPEAKER_01: 20:05

And then I'll say, well, wait a minute. Then I'll ask them a question. Well, how do you do that?

SPEAKER_00: 20:11

Right.

SPEAKER_01: 20:11

Or why do you do it that way? Right. That opens up a whole conversation now that we begin to share information each other.

SPEAKER_02: 20:19

So you don't even have to do that. I can sit down and print and look at somebody and find a way to start talking to by what they're wearing. Oh, yeah. Yeah, you know, if you sit down and you got Bixie RCD shirt on, even though I may know what it is, so tell me about your RCD shirt. How did you get your RCD? How did you study for it? Do you find it valuable? Just get people talking and break down that barrier. I mean, it's it's it's a lot easier than I really ever thought it would be. You know, so you learn them skills.

SPEAKER_01: 20:45

And another well, we talk about Valley, the uh library, the document one that's available to you through Bixie. And a lot of times they're discounted at the at the show. Um I keep I keep a full library for my text. Uh I've seen that library. I've been in your office because we're neighbors. Oh because I I can't remember it all. Yes, it's knowing where to look.

unknown: 21:14

Yes.

SPEAKER_01: 21:15

Uh and the this organization has helped me with that, and then having the opportunity to be involved in writing some of these documents also helps because now you're doing research that make you learn right something you didn't look.

SPEAKER_02: 21:29

Right. So you've been in you've been many, many colleges, right? You've probably seen that these probably and I know you got a billion stories. Just give me one one story on how somebody came to an event and then they left feeling plugged in.

SPEAKER_01: 21:45

Oh, this is here. Um actually, there's a uh young gentleman who worked for me for a little while. He's now working for a local school board. Um and I got him to attend uh and he uh sat for his uh RCDD. He now has his RCDD. It gave him a career opportunity uh to move to a different uh or income, or not income, but a uh little step up uh to work for an organization uh that offered him and his family better benefits than I could have provided at the time. So and I've always enjoyed watching an employee grow, whether it's with me or outside the organization. So uh I I'm always thrilled about uh an employee that that you watch them step up and grow.

SPEAKER_02: 22:45

I that there's there are many people in my professional life that I still I may not talk to them daily, but I still keep in touch with them, even though we don't walk together anymore. And I and you know we're friends on Facebook and I see them at events, stuff like that. Just that's what that's why I said earlier. When you come here, you're only an outsider until you walk through the front door.

SPEAKER_03: 23:05

Exactly.

SPEAKER_02: 23:06

You're yeah, after that, you're family, but you gotta you gotta you that can be a dysfunctional fanism. I think that's that. But but all you gotta do is just is just put out a little bit of effort, and most people here, you start talking about anything, they will hook it up. Because that's we're we're here for networking. That's one of the one of the big threes why you go to events is you go to network. Exactly. Because you might it's not just to find customers, but again, you know, a solution. I was having dinner last night with some people, and one of the person was in the dinner uh works for uh a company. I I don't want to say the name yet, but they they're well known for making cameras. Okay, and uh, you know, I was like, hey, I should I should get you on the podcast as an episode. If I'd never gone to dinner, if I never networked, we've never had that opportunity.

SPEAKER_01: 23:48

In fact, you're one of the best I've seen at network you through your podcast, and also the training you do for those preparing for the RCD buy. Uh because it's not something they're paying extra for. Right. You give them an opportunity to, in a group environment, even though it's all online, right? I see that that helps you learn, it helps you grow. When I took classes for my RCDD, it was done in a classroom environment. So you shared with other people in class. I'm not a good webload.

SPEAKER_02: 24:26

Yeah, I mean you uh I struggle sometimes. Uh I'm an early adopter, but I struggle with technology. Yeah, I I force myself through.

SPEAKER_01: 24:36

And so I I found it harder to learn through web webinars than I do in a uh more social environment in a classroom.

SPEAKER_02: 24:48

Winter winter chicken dinner. I've I've I'll I'll preach us from the top of the mountain. If you want to teach somebody in this field, you've got to incorporate hands-on. Yeah, you've got we're we're tactile learners. You know, I can sit and talk about the you know how to terminate a jack all day long and the nuances of working with this type of jack versus that type of a jack or testing or whatever, but it really sinks in and you put your hands on it. You got the coach. Yeah, absolutely. Okay, lightning round. Okay, lightning round. Five questions. Quick off the cuff, right? What is the first session a newbie should go to when they come to an event like this? First session, not the not the members of the village. What's the first session they should think about to newcomers? Yep. Okay, now that's next one. You do a lot of walking. Oh, absolutely. Footwear, footwear is key, right? Footwear is key. Yeah, make sure you got comfortable shoes. So tennis shoes, or I already know the answer because I can see your feet. Tennis shoes, dress shoes, or boots.

SPEAKER_01: 25:48

Oh, tennis shoes, oh yeah. There you go. In fact, I'll share a quick story. When I was on the board and they would do the board group pictures, myself and Ray Craig will go on board at the same time. Always wore tennis shoes. I got Ed Donovan was president at the time. Uh huh. And he says, you know, he says, I was so proud to have that picture of the group of us uh to put up on my office wall. He says, I look down and there's you and Ray Craig wearing tennis shoes.

SPEAKER_02: 26:23

Yeah, I got a Ray Craig story too. So I I attend all the committee meetings now, but I don't do a lot of volunteer work because I got so much stuff going on in my life right now. I just I literally don't have time, but but I always get to stay plugged in. But I used to do a lot of work. And and I was at a committee meeting once, and he came in with a suitcase. And I'm like, why is he coming in with a suitcase? And then he sat down at the table, he was in my suitcase, he had every manual that you can think of in that suitcase of building. I was like, that's pretty smart. That's actually pretty smart. So I do like the that you can get the manuals. PDF. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, so there's a man's searching you. Well, that's see, that's right. So, and because I run the RCD study groups. When I when I'm when I'm gonna learn, I want a book, I want pages. If I want to search something, control F. All right, it's with your fastest friends, the easiest way to go through the document. In fact, I subscribe to the NEC. Yes, because if I find it easier. You know, you don't have to subscribe to the NEC to get to the NEC 3, right? There's other documents. Oh, okay. And I get the the uh Dodge Technical Bulletin.

SPEAKER_01: 27:31

Yeah, okay. Um but it's it's a great I you can't remember everything in the NEC, even though I hold an electrical license. You can't remember all the the places in the NEC, and that's going for a big change. Right. Okay, last one.

SPEAKER_02: 27:47

When's the best time to go visit the exhibit hall?

SPEAKER_01: 27:52

Shortly after vote.

SPEAKER_02: 27:54

Staying with a big huge crowd of people, and I'm kind of going to be.

SPEAKER_01: 27:57

I find I find the first night that it's open, I do it when I call a skim walk. I do the same thing.

SPEAKER_02: 28:06

I go I will walk up and down every aisle, just kind of looking at the booth.

SPEAKER_01: 28:08

Right. And then I'll come back to the room. I want to see what's new. Yes. Uh, I'll also remember, you know, I need to talk to those people. Right. Yes. Uh, but um I'll come back. Then I'll usually try to pick a time that's a little slower uh in the afternoon or uh uh they have have a morning uh session, and then I will go back and pinpoint the people I really need to talk to or the product I really want to look at.

SPEAKER_02: 28:36

And that's another reason to have your book because it's got the map on there. You can actually have the map up with all the vendors. You can circle the ones to check off a good back with because you know, especially at the at the conference where we have a lot of exhibitors, you can get lost sometimes. Yeah, and some and unless they have a bit you know, a thing hanging from the ceiling, you know. If you're looking for one of the smaller vendors, it's kind of they also too in the exhibit hall.

SPEAKER_01: 28:58

They have the uh what's new, what's it do? I'm gonna be there today. Absolutely. It's a it's a great uh opportunity to learn about the new product developments that have come out. Uh and it's yes, they're they're showcasing their products, but that's okay. Yes. Um, it gives you an opportunity because that's how I found answers. Yes. I had I ran into a situation several years ago. Uh the my client had built a new building and built the conference room. Well, he put in the conduits underneath the table were only three-quarters. He wanted to be able to hook up laptops and project onto uh the screen, right? Well, you can't get an HDMI cable free there at that court, right? I had come to uh just been at a Bixie conference and I came across a product line, right, that used transceivers. Over cat six on each end.

SPEAKER_02: 30:02

Right. Yours.

SPEAKER_01: 30:03

Uh I'm going, that fixed that does what I needed to do. Yeah. Because now I have a device I can put underneath in the conference room table and behind the TV. I solved it because I'm going, I don't, you know, I can't go back and tell this guy I gotta dig up his his slab. Right.

SPEAKER_02: 30:22

You know, one of the the I think I think I haven't been to the exhibit hall yet here because it doesn't open until a little later today. Right. But when I was in Orlando, this must sound so weird. The best product that I saw at that whole entire thing was a tie wrap. Invent came out with a tie wrap that you don't even need sniffs. You can just take it, cut, twist it, and it cuts it flat. How many times have you come home with scars on your on your arms because somebody up in the ceiling didn't cut the tie rap switch? You know? Simple things like that. And you don't know that if you don't walk into the exhibit.

SPEAKER_01: 30:54

Oh, Mag Daddy was not. Yeah, oh yes. Um the first time I saw it, I'm going, okay. Yeah, in the back of my mind. Well, sure enough, within about two years, I ran into a product project that the Mag Daddy was perfect for what we needed to do. Because it was a red iron red iron decking.

SPEAKER_02: 31:13

And uh it worked out great. Yeah, absolutely. You don't have to shoot in the red iron, and you and and you could do that with a pole. You can take you can take a painter's pole, uh huh. You know, one with a long painter's pole, and just put it on and think you never have to get a scaffold.

SPEAKER_01: 31:27

You'll come across products that have been developed because of other people's experience. Yeah, and you it you'll remember down with that. There's a product that will help me do this. And you go, okay, I saw it. And then you start doing the research, and sure enough, you'll find that you saw it at Bixie Conference. Absolutely. So that that's one of the things I've gotten out all over the years is finding solutions. Because that's what I try to do for my customers. Let me know what your pain point is, let me know what you're trying. Sit down, we'll talk about what you're trying to do, and then I'll go find a solution to you, put the solution package together. I don't blame I don't sell to my customer. Educate. Yes. I try to find solutions to resolve their product. I get paid for doing that if I do it right. Yep. So uh that's my that's always been my approach, right? Uh I don't sell use cars. Uh I represent high quality install okay. Chuck. Thank you for coming on the show. Thank you. I know you got a meeting you'd attend. Yep. I appreciate you taking the time out of your busy day. By any of these young people or first timers, don't have to be young. Uh, get involved. Get involved. That's it right there. Knowledge is power.

SPEAKER_02: 32:50

You know that's recorded now.