LTC Rewind: Empowering Future ICT Leaders: Training, Certification, and Women in Construction

Get ready to unravel the secrets behind nurturing the next generation of ICT professionals with the insight of Shelly Olmsted, Director of Quality and Development at IES Communications . This episode promises a robust discussion challenging the myth that today’s youth are unmotivated, by spotlighting the importance of training and mentorship. We take a deep dive with Shelly, exploring how companies can ignite a passion for quality in their staff and the ripple effect this has on customer satisfaction.

Strap in as we tackle the Herculean task of staying current in the ever-advancing world of ICT. Together with Shelly, we navigate the labyrinth of job titles versus skills, specifically dissecting the project manager's role and the necessity for swift, effective training. We also analyze the weight certifications from entities like Bixie carry within the industry and what that means for the professionals behind the wires and screens. This episode is a treasure trove for those looking to understand the intricacies of technical training and certification.

Lastly, join us in celebrating Women in Construction Week, as we highlight the strides towards diversity and inclusion within the trades. Shelly shares her powerful journey, shattering stereotypes and opening doors for opportunity regardless of gender. We discuss the transformative potential of leadership that invests in every individual as a future leader, and we tease a future debate on balancing the cost of subpar quality against the investment in excellence. Tune in for an episode that's not just about the tech in ICT, but the human touch that drives its progress.

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:00

On this week's episode, we're going to talk about educating young people in our industry. Welcome to the show where we tackle the tough questions submitted by installers, estimators, project managers, customers and anybody in ICT. We are connecting at the human level so that we can connect the world. If you're watching this show on YouTube, would you mind hitting the subscribe button and the bell button to be notified when new content is being created? If you're listening to us on one of the podcast platforms, would you mind giving us a five-star rating please? If it's not a five-star, shoot me an email and let me know what I can do to make it better. Those two little steps helps us take on that algorithm and get this content out to more people in the industry so we can educate, encourage and enrich the lives of the people in our industry. What are you doing?

Speaker 1: 1:01

Thursday night, 6 pm, Eastern Standard Time, we do an after-hours live show where you get to ask your favorite RCDD that would be me your favorite questions about installation, design, certification, estimation, project management, career advice. I can hear you now, but, Chuck, I'm driving home at that time. I don't want to be watching the film while I'm driving a company vehicle. It might be a safety violation. Okay, they're recorded and you can watch them either on YouTube or off of our webpage at letstalkcablingcom. This week, I put out a post on all my social media platforms what is your biggest frustration about the ICT industry? And I'm going to make shows about every one of those responses, but one of the responses came back. Let me read this to you it was lack of skill or motivation by younger generation. Pathetic labor pool. Well, ironically, I already had this interview already scheduled up, so the person I'm bringing on the show today is a fellow trainer with lots of experience, and I'm looking really forward to this interview. Shelly Olmsted, how are you doing today?

Speaker 2: 2:08

Well, I am great Thanks for inviting me.

Speaker 1: 2:11

My pleasure, my pleasure. So let's start off with. We always have to start with a good foundation, right, so people understand who you are and why should they listen to you? Right, give us a 30 second highlight of your career and the certifications and or accomplishments that you might have done.

Speaker 2: 2:29

Well, why they should listen to me. I don't know. That's a great question, but I will tell you. As far as the industry goes, I always say I married into this industry 30 years ago. My husband was a tech one when we got married and over time just many of our friends were in the same field and about 10 years ago one of them was the VP of operations at IS Communications and he called me and he asked me if I'd be interested in talking to him about a job. I was like I don't know.

Speaker 2: 3:02

I've been in the staffing and recruiting industry, had my own consulting thing, training, helping with training and helping businesses with career plans and things like that. But I met him for lunch and honestly, it changed my life. That he and IS had about investing in their people and not just adding a few classes here and there, and there was passion and had all these innovative ideas to sharpen skill sets and you know, and in turn give customers the experience that they were promised. And I was like this company gets it. And it wasn't to be in a consultant role, it was to come on board and be a part of the team and over the years it's just evolved and we've tied our quality and our development, our employee development pieces together. Here I am. That's what I'm doing.

Speaker 1: 3:58

But it obviously must be working because you are considered one of the top tier companies in the industry. I mean, I'm well familiar with your company, even before the other relationship that there is existing between Chuck and IES. I've been familiar with you guys a long time and you guys are obviously doing right. I put you in. There's a group of about four or five contractors that I would lump into what I would call the gold standard, and that's obviously you guys. So you guys are doing it right. So here's the first question.

Speaker 2: 4:29

Thank you, I really appreciate that. You know we really, we really get behind the motto. You know, if we train people right the first time and clearly, and communicate what those expectations that they are and we provide them all the resources like training and career paths and mentorship, the quality is going to be there and we really believe that. You know, you've probably heard this said before but when we get the employee experience right, we'll get the customer experience right. And we've proven, you know, not only to the industry, I feel, but also just internally to our company, that this department adds value and gives the end users we service that experience. So thank you for saying gold standard. I like that.

Speaker 1: 5:11

Not a problem, and I do. I've done a lot of work for Marriott's over the years and I stayed a lot of Marriott's because I travel all the time. Yeah, and one of the things I always hear JW Marriott always said is if you take care of your employees, they'll take care of your customers. Jw Marriott always said is you take care of your employees, they'll take care of your customers. So you need to really invest in your people. It'll pay a hundredfold and, unfortunately, the training program is usually the first thing that gets cut when the economy goes down, when you need it the most, you need it the most. So here comes the first question.

Speaker 1: 5:45

Here comes the first question. So there's a lot of talk, a lot of noise right now about the younger generation. The younger generation just doesn't want to learn. They feel entitled. They don't want to learn, they don't want to climb the ladder. What do you find in your sphere of influence?

Speaker 2: 6:01

You know, I kind of see that in a different way.

Speaker 2: 6:05

What I've seen is that the younger generation is interested in bettering themselves.

Speaker 2: 6:09

They are, and so that traditional climbing scenario it just might look different now as leadership, take a step back and say, okay, you know, their perspective is their reality.

Speaker 2: 6:25

It's not that they don't have talent and skills, because they definitely do, but maybe we need to stop looking at it in the traditional sense because, okay, so let's just think about it. You know they love technology, right, and you know they might not remember the pager in the fax machine, but they've grown up with some of the greatest technological advances in history and that is what they're building from. So they're going to be the next generation to build on top of what their reality has been. And I feel like by showing them that the ICT industry is the background of all that technology that they love and that runs their lives, that increases their interest, and we've used that as how we're promoting and recruiting lately, and being here at IES as a technology innovator that's what we do has really helped us. Let them see what the true career path is and we kind of flip the script a little bit and it's been successful.

Speaker 1: 7:28

Absolutely. And it's funny, you and I, I think, are right along the same lines. I remember when I was coming up to the ranks, people were saying the same thing about me when I was a young kid Right, and you hit the nail on the head it's how they, it's their learning styles, right. So, as a, as a good manager, you've got to it's like a customer. You've got to think about how I reach that person or those individuals where it's going to make the impact the most right. And I'll just give you a real quick example TikTok, tiktok. I stayed away from TikTok with my platform because it was that dancing video thing. There are a lot of low-voltage people on TikTok. There's one guy rep. He's got like a hundred thousand followers. There's a lot of level and and my target is the younger people. So I gotta go where they are. So you know, you gotta think outside of the box for that kind of stuff.

Speaker 2: 8:17

you really do and that's our, that's not only our future, but those are the people we need to get into the workforce now and teach them this stuff, because you know they don't they don't don't have college, college courses for this right we can attract and I love it. Use TikTok, use where they are at and and, as you know, as a good trainer, I don't know your audience. You've got to be be coming in at their level. I don't know your audience, you've got to be coming in at their level. And what we created here at IS Internally was we've got to express ourselves in a way that makes sense to people. So what is it? And it's through technology. Yes, we have a ton of in-person classes, but we had to evolve with e-learning and virtual instructor and set up the streaming platforms and all those things. So, while the traditional climbing the ladder has worked in the past and there's definitely still some good things about that we have to just look at how do we make it better and communicate in a way that's going to make sense to them.

Speaker 1: 9:21

Yeah, I think their non-traditional way of looking at things and I've gotten this from being a trainer I think it's refreshing Because you know you can take three people and ask them how to fix something, who have been in the industry for years and years and years, and you'll get the same answer from all three of them. And yeah, it might get done that way, but then somebody who comes fresh with the freshest eyes, they see it with the perspective that the other people don't and it might even be better. The key is that those people have to be open to it and I think that's where that comment comes from. It comes from fear because they see these younger people coming in and they approach training and jobs and career differently than we did. And I think the people who've expressed frustration with the younger generation I think they just don't truly understand them.

Speaker 1: 10:07

You get to take some time and I love how you said I think they just don't truly understand them. You get to take some time and I love how you said you got to know your audience. When I sit in a class as a trainer, I'm there for two reasons One, to learn the content. Two, I'm there to evaluate that trainer, because I want to pick up something that trainer's doing, so I can apply it.

Speaker 2: 10:21

Absolutely.

Speaker 1: 10:22

And I can always tell a good trainer in the very beginning of the class because they're going to do some kind of an activity or some kind of a question right out of the gate to gauge their audience right. You know how many years experience does everybody have? Right? Because the worst thing you could do is try to teach the color code to somebody who's got 20 years of experience, right. You're going to lose them. You're going to lose them.

Speaker 2: 10:46

True. And in turn, the person with 20 years of experience has to also keep an open mind that, hey, everybody's an expert in something, and if you come into that scenario with your mind open, that hey, you know what? I haven't lived in their shoes and had their perspective. There could be stuff about technology or a quicker, more efficient way to do stuff that in my 20 years I just haven't come across yet because I've been so right, I've been doing it my way, it's been my way, or the highway, and I haven't let some of these other other influences in. So I think it's two way street. I think it's two ways street.

Speaker 1: 11:26

And if you couple that with our industry right now we work in the communications industry, but I look at it like a bicycle, right, a bicycle has wheels, a handlebar, a seat, a frame. You know I might be a subject matter expert in structure, cabling the frame, but when it comes to installing active components for access, control and voice, I don't know that stuff. There are no experts in the industry. But when it comes to installing active components for access, control and voice, I weapon and so I don't know that stuff. There are no experts in industry. And I love how you said you got to have an open mind. I've been in this industry for 40 plus years and I will tell people right out of the gate your goal every day should to be learned one new thing every day, because you don't know.

Speaker 1: 12:05

You don't know.

Speaker 2: 12:07

That's our motto in the training department here. Yeah, you don't know everything. That's that's our motto in the training department here.

Speaker 1: 12:12

Yeah, continuous improvement everybody can learn something new every day, even even us old people like me. So so you obviously are running a training program. You get to train a lot of great people and stuff in your sphere of influence. What do you find is the skill that's the weakest amongst all of them? Not, not not individual people, but as a group. What do you think is the weakest amongst all of them? Not individual people, but as a group. What do you think is the weakest area?

Speaker 2: 12:32

Honestly, I don't know if it's one thing specifically technically. What I do know is that you know so we employ thousands of people and technology changes so fast that sometimes it's difficult to deliver the latest and greatest training to everybody. So you know our development list of all the things that we're continually adding as far as additional classes. Or you know adding content or improving content, because you know, now Bixie has released this, they've changed that. Or you know something else has changed when 3456 came out. We're now or business that we're adding. You know we do controls. Now we're adding this to security, whatever. I just feel like sometimes the weakest part of that is not being able to deliver it fast enough to the thousands of people that work for us. So because, as you also know, we have, you know, our industry. The job titles within our industry have grown over I mean the 10 years I've been here. You know not used to have been in the industry 40 years. I mean it used to be, hey, what you had a technician and a PM and an estimator.

Speaker 2: 13:42

And now we've got. You know there's so many other levels in there that sometimes that's also a challenge to get it all out.

Speaker 1: 13:51

Our industry is horrible. Horrible with job titles. Yes, because you can take somebody who has a business card that says well, I'm a project manager at my old company, so you should hire me as a project manager. And then when you get them in and interview them, you're going to find out they were just a glorified foreman, because a project manager can be tracking schedules and material costs and labor costs and managing change orders and scope creep and all that stuff. And they just were given that title by the other company because you know the guy needed a raise and they had to find a way to give him a raise. And they're not really a project manager.

Speaker 2: 14:34

No, not in the traditional sense yeah or not. In a defined sense, especially in a bigger organization, it's like no, there's a lot more that goes into that role.

Speaker 1: 14:38

And if you throw that person into a scenario where, if you don't do your due diligence as an employer and really evaluate them when they come on board and find out, no, they're not really a project manager, really evaluate them when they come on board and find out, no, they're not really a project manager, you'll send them out on a job site with a general contractor with a PMP certified project manager there and they will tear them up. Tear them up.

Speaker 2: 15:00

Every time.

Speaker 1: 15:01

Exactly right.

Speaker 2: 15:02

And then your HR department definitely hears about it.

Speaker 1: 15:05

Yep, exactly I thought you hired a project manager. His resume said nope.

Speaker 2: 15:12

Yeah, if we believed all the resumes everybody would be executives right.

Speaker 1: 15:18

People don't lie on resumes, never.

Speaker 2: 15:21

Or can't have a business card made to say whatever. I think mine says Empress of the Universe or something. Oh, I like that I like that.

Speaker 1: 15:29

That is cool, that is cool, that is cool. So let's ask you the flip side of that. So I asked you what you thought was the weakest. What do you think is the area of strength when it comes to training people? Now, what?

Speaker 2: 15:40

are they?

Speaker 1: 15:40

strongest in.

Speaker 2: 15:41

I feel like for us it's pretty. Anything technical I mean we've got that dialed in. Bixie's been great. We have six Bixie ATFs. We're probably adding another one, so there's a lot of technically. I think we we've again there's so many job titles now that fall into that. I think there's a lot of great information out there. Again, it's just as technology changes, as manufacturers develop and let next latest and greatest. I just don't sometimes think that information is just delivered quick enough.

Speaker 1: 16:15

Yeah, since you mentioned Bixie and I know Bixie is not the only place out there that gives certifications, but they're the most well-known in our industry what do you find is the attitude towards certification? Because one of the most, one of the most hottest subjects I can do a post on is about certification. Because I'll get the people to get on there and say, yeah, you need your certifications, and I'll get others to say, well, I've been doing this for 20 years. I know more than that person with the certification. What are your thoughts on certification?

Speaker 2: 16:44

And a lot of times they're not wrong right they're not wrong.

Speaker 1: 16:47

Yeah, that's true not wrong.

Speaker 2: 16:52

Right, they're not wrong. Yeah, that's true. We have seen. We have definitely seen growth in the number of interested people in certifications. But it's interesting because a lot of our customers are driving that they're interested in having the certified folks on their site. So again, adding you know, bixie, or you know that's speaking of, you know in the structured world, but you know for, for our specialty systems. You know CTS, ctsi, you know, you know on AV sides, things like that. So, yeah, depend, no matter what the scope is. It seems there has been an increase in that and again, it's just getting it delivered fast enough. Right.

Speaker 1: 17:32

See, I didn't realize you guys did. I mean, I knew you did AV stuff, but I didn't realize you put an emphasis on the AV certifications. You guys have just now moved to the top part of the gold standard.

Speaker 2: 17:43

Oh well, would you like me to tell you everything I used to?

Speaker 1: 17:46

You keep doing that, you guys might be at the very top of the gold standard. I have no problem with that, chuck, let's go, we do jazz.

Speaker 2: 17:52

We do life, safety, we do Wi-Fi, we do everything. We do everything. We're proud to say that. Generally, you know, with our customers, yeah, structured cable has been our bread and butter for, you know, the whole time we've been in business. But we again going back to having that customer experience, you know, hey, we have those conversations Well, what else do you need? Well, yeah, we do that, or we do that, or if we don't, we will learn. If that's something that's up and coming, we're flexible.

Speaker 2: 18:25

And again going back to the initial conversation I had with Matt Sims to be recruited into IES they're nimble and innovative. They're willing to take a look at it and take, you know, invest in and whatever the future for the industry is. And that helps everybody. Right, getting everything, getting people that experience, getting them the exposure to those different areas, will definitely make a huge, huge difference. And, yes, making sure then having the responsibility then to your employees to say, okay, well, we're now doing that line of business, we will help you get certified in that line of business, that's, that's the right thing to do.

Speaker 1: 19:06

Yeah, one of the one of the flip sides a lot of people don't think about certification for their employees is once you start getting people certified, you got to track those to make sure that they don't lump lapse.

Speaker 2: 19:18

Yep, Yep. So here we went. When I started 10 years ago, we had four people in the training department. I have 41 people now.

Speaker 2: 19:29

In the training department Training and quality department is 41 people and it's because of our quality they're called quality training specialists because they are the trainers and then they're the ones that go and inspect the work to make sure, hey, what's taught to, what they taught actually sunk in and was translated into that work product. So that's how that, that's how I got that strange title director of quality and development. It's not usually two things you see together, but we did it that way because we felt like going back to making sure that our employee was taken care of, because that's going to take care of our customer. If you marry those you know those two concepts and ideas together, then you can do that all in one team. So that's why we have so many and we're absolutely dedicated to quality control.

Speaker 1: 20:21

Yeah, that just kind of shows the depth of the intent of the company, right, because anybody can train their people. But if you don't go out to verify that they're doing it and I'm not saying that people will sit in a class and then just deliberately choose not to use the skills they learned, at best if you're in a classroom environment without any hands-on component, at best you might remember 25% six months after that day. So it's reinforcing.

Speaker 2: 20:49

I would argue that percentage is probably less. Yeah, it's amazing. If you don't, it goes back to if you don't use it, you lose it, yep, and if you don't have somebody holding you accountable to that, you'll lose it. So that's, that's what that's what it stands for, and we it is out of you know, for lack of a better term it's out of love for the employees. Look, we want to help you, we want you to remember this and become better, and if you do want to quote unquote, climb the ladder, hey, this is going to give you that opportunity and we'll open that door because you are now somebody who has become an expert at that and hopefully, with all the other soft skill stuff that we've also worked on, you're dependable, you're a good communicator, you're reliable to to get the job done and in that time frame I mean, that's how you take care of them is holding them accountable- and I love the fact that you got people going out there doing QA inspections, because I was a QA inspector for a large contractor for many, many years.

Speaker 1: 21:45

Oh yeah, I had somebody in last night's after hours live asked me what does it take to be a good QA, qc person? And one of the things I think the most important thing is how you deliver the results of the inspection right If you go in there, because you should always review, you know, take the QA form and you should always review it with the person that you were inspecting. But you always want to start off with the good stuff. Hey, I like the way you dressed the cable. I like the way you did this. I love the way you did that. You did a really good job over here and then you shift and you say now let's look at some things that we can improve on next time. You use it as a mini training session. If you go there, you did this wrong. You did that. They're not going to listen to you, period, and you just lost all your effectiveness of a training program.

Speaker 2: 22:34

Right, so you do, you work here. That's like exactly the message. Yes, you can hit, hit it on the head. Um, you know. I always say, especially when we're recruiting um for these roles, is, you know, we can obviously make sure you can get trained technically on just about anything. And if you your work, you want to get a certain certification? Hey, I know where you can get that. Right, that's what we do. But I can't make you care. I could teach you probably just about anything technically, but I can't make you care. I can't make you give a crap about that team or about that person individually or about that customer. That's something you either do or you don't. You're driven. That's an internal thing and that's hard to stay on a resume and that's hard to. That's hard to you know it's hard to teach.

Speaker 2: 23:23

Then, yeah, you can't always vet that out in an interview that is, through action, that is, when rubber hits the road and you're out there. Whether you're, you're really showing and caring about those people, because those people are the ones that blossom and turn into the next and the next, and the next.

Speaker 1: 23:40

So, um, yeah, I I agree with you on that one of the one of the things I found as a, as a, because I was the peak performance manager fancy title for for running the qa department ppm. The peak performance manager Fancy title for running the QA department Peak performance, ppm. Yeah, peak performance manager, and one of the ways that I've found that you can help to address people, to get that that skillset there, to really have the drive to want to improve, is through a mentoring program. Right, so do you guys have a mentoring program there at IES?

Speaker 2: 24:11

Well, we do, in the sense that we have a couple of different ways that it happens. So, through the quality program, as you said, you know, we, we, are that outside influence to help develop employees.

Speaker 2: 24:21

We can be walking a job and go okay, hey, hey, everybody, real quick. I see what you did here. Huddle up, let me show you this might be a more efficient way, or did you know that this is a better way, or whatever? So we have those moments and those opportunities when new hires come on board, we have them paired up with people, as most people would want to put the new guy with an experienced guy.

Speaker 2: 24:48

Right Is generally how that works out. But we also have a. We have a strategic action team through our leadership program that they actually develop ideas around these types of how do we mentor better, how do we? So coming up with a very structured, more formal one is the goal. We have it kind of in a grassroots and more informal process right now, but I believe it is key. It is really important to add.

Speaker 1: 25:20

Now this question is going to be geared not necessarily towards the people in the field, but managers of companies and companies who they say they have a training program, or they think they have a training program, or they dream of having a training program. Right, until they see the actual cost of a training program. Different ballpark there.

Speaker 1: 25:40

And I'm not asking you to give me numbers but as an overall sense, do you feel that all the effort and the time and the blood and the sweat and the IES invest in our employees in the training program? Is that paying off with customer satisfaction?

Speaker 2: 25:56

And I can say unequivocally yes, absolutely. You know all companies have to make that choice. You know you were just kind of elaborating a little bit on what all was involved with that. It is an expensive proposition but, again, I've never worked for an organization more willing to invest in people. And what I would hope is you know that other people could get that opportunity as well is when you do take the time and you have qualified and people that are excited to come to work because they're going to learn something, and that they know that the company cares about moving them forward not only professionally but personally, that that attracts better customers, that attracts those type of companies that are also wanting to do that with their employees. And it's amazing how your best marketing tool out there are your people. So if you can make these types of decisions and invest in them, you're going to see the dividends pay off with that level of business coming back to you with your customer makeup.

Speaker 1: 27:06

Oh, absolutely. And I tell people all the time it's okay to fire a customer, right, because you're going to have customers from time to time. All they care about is the bottom dollar. They don't care about the quality, they don't care about the performance, they just want it in for the cheap. That's not the kind of customer you want. It's not.

Speaker 1: 27:20

And one of the ways that I would help vet out my customers when I used to run the performance department is, after I got done, reviewing the QA with the individuals in the field and and if I found any defects, we would come up with an action plan. Like I did a project once where they didn't put in the ladder correctly. So I said here's what we got to do to fix it. Here's the day we got to get it fixed by and I got their buy in. So then I went to the customer and I reviewed the QA with the customer and the customer was like I didn't even know that was wrong. Thank you for educating me on that. And now what that does is Did they put it in upside down? Well, no, what they did was they mounted the triangle brackets to the plywood with drywall screws.

Speaker 1: 28:00

Oh yeah, yeah, that's a no-no, that's a no-no.

Speaker 2: 28:02

Yeah, I don't think that's one of our standards either.

Speaker 1: 28:05

No, yeah, so I explained that to the customer. I go, I didn't even know that. But what that does now is I'm now educating the customer. So now, if the customer does happen to put out a competitive bid and another contractor should happen to win it for whatever reason, if they're doing it wrong, I've educated the customer. No, you know what that's wrong and that's good with that other company because they do it right and then they'll take time to educate me. So I found it's kind of a it helps all the way around. Another common comment that I got on that post I mentioned earlier was lack of knowledge by management, not knowing what the low voltage workers are doing. How do you guys address that issue?

Speaker 2: 28:47

Well, first of all, great comment. And I can say, you know, over the years that had been earlier when I came on board, it was definitely something that we battled as well. I think, as you grow in this industry, you know the company has seen exponential growth and the managers seem to get more busy with the management and the meetings and the administrative side than what's going on in the field. And I think then the field feels like maybe they get disconnected. And how we battled that is like hey, you need to be connecting with your teams, you need to get to know the people that are doing the work, get to know and understand their. You know what's their family situation. I mean you just have to connect.

Speaker 2: 29:34

And that's our biggest. You know, one of our catchphrase things is hey, we make connections that connect the world, whether it's through social media or banking or whatever. Right You're making those connections. Hey, why don't you take a moment to connect with your actual team and learn and hear what are they going through? So we've implemented, you know, project management standards. And hey, you need to be meeting with your team weekly. You need to be out on the. You know we have job sites where obviously they're on job site 100% of the time because it's maybe a bigger project and that's where everybody's living, or maybe they've got multiple projects and you need to make sure that you're making time to get out and spend time with the teams, walk it with them, talk to them about what their challenges have been and really get to know. So it's all about the relationship. It's all about connection.

Speaker 1: 30:25

Yep. That's why the motto of my show is connecting at the human level so we can connect the world.

Speaker 2: 30:30

I like it.

Speaker 1: 30:32

Let me ask you this Our industry is a male dominated industry and we're starting to finally see some more diversity. What do you feel? Do you think that we're doing a good job at it? Can we improve? What are your thoughts on that?

Speaker 2: 30:47

Well, we've already said there's a. You know we have to be continuously improving, chuck right, I have seen that industry-wide. You know it's a Women in Construction Week this week, for example, and there's been a lot more attention given to that. I've seen some great profiles being, you know, on LinkedIn and some of the other platforms, so that's great to see. We obviously take that seriously. We've always been diverse. You know. We've always had a lot of inclusion and included. You know, and this week we're talking about women. You know women have been in our workforce. You know, when we look at our industry numbers and diversity numbers, we're better than the industry average, but always being a leader to providing a path to anyone who wants to learn a trade, we don't, we don't care. I mean, you know, if you are interested and you're invested and ready to make a commitment. We have people of all all walks of life coming and joining us and it's really, I think, been a huge part of why we're successful. That's because we try to keep that as an open door.

Speaker 1: 31:53

Sounds like a winning plan. One final question If you could find the magic way to roll back the hands of time and talk to a young 18-year Shelly, what would you what? What advice would you give her?

Speaker 2: 32:09

I would probably tell her to think bigger, think bigger. You know, going back to your question about diversity, and you know, being a woman in construction, being a woman in this industry, when it first, when Matt first called me to talk to me about, I'm like I don't know if I belong, like I don't know if I belong there. I don't know if that's think bigger. Even 10 years ago, I'd probably said that I belong here and you have something to offer and there's a lot of strengths that I bring that I didn't have here before. So, understanding that and giving yourself the room to develop and I'm very fortunate I came into a group that were management was absolutely all about it, right, we? I know that that some people haven't had that experience with management, so I was very blessed in that sense that they were like you know, hey, we're providing a path to anyone who wants to learn and be a part of the IAS family and learn a trade. So, um, yeah, those two words think bigger, shelly, you can do better than that. Let's think out here.

Speaker 1: 33:16

It sounds like you have a great executive team there at the company, cause there's a lot of companies out there. They're there, they have the mindset of the old guard. And I'll give you a real quick example. I remember again, I'm showing my age here but I was working for a company and I realized we need to get emails. So I talked to my boss and said we need to have emails. He's like why do we need emails? I had to write a justification report as to why we needed emails. Again, that kind of ties in I had to write a justification report as to why we needed emails. Yeah, again, that kind of ties in the younger generation have different ways of looking thing and if that person doesn't have that hunger for knowledge, that hunger for growth, there are people who have jobs and there are people who have careers.

Speaker 2: 34:01

Yes, I would agree with that, and understanding that there is a difference is the first step with leadership, right, you're not offering somebody a job, you're offering them a career opportunity. And, like I said, I went and had lunch with Matt Sims and it changed my life for real. I'd never, I'd never thought, I never thought about being in this industry. I'd watched my husband like pulling cable and eventually, over the years, you know, moving up and and he joined a Denver based company that wanted him to open a branch. We lived in Tucson, arizona, at the time and they wanted to open a branch. Well, he had to open it, you know. Basically start business out of our house, where I am literally receiving materials at my house while he's on a job site and helping put some spreadsheets together to help him track stuff. You know, you know back back in that time and again, we should have thought bigger then too.

Speaker 2: 35:01

It's like it's. It's amazing if you just learn.

Speaker 1: 35:06

I like that one. I'm writing that one down Think bigger.

Speaker 2: 35:11

Just think bigger. Whatever you're thinking right now, think bigger.

Speaker 1: 35:14

You know what I think. I think I might title this podcast that think bigger. Of course, I got to get your permission to use that title though I grant that will make no problem. It's recorded. You can't take it back now as long as you put the little squiggly line, and then Shelly after. It's a quote. It's kind of hard to do that in a title, but I'll definitely put it in the opening credits. Any parting words of wisdom before we close out.

Speaker 2: 35:48

I would say that everybody again can prove every day on something and don't limit yourself to just what you're doing today. To management I always say, hey, make sure whoever you're interviewing, you're interviewing them for the next position, you know. Think of it as a career. Think of the people that I bring onto my team. I think, hey, this is somebody that needs to be able to replace me someday. Give them that opportunity and make sure we're providing all of the training not just technical all of the training that's going to be needed and you will have a much more successful workforce and you're going to have wildly happy customers.

Speaker 2: 36:29

So, thank you.

Speaker 1: 36:31

Absolutely Right on the nose, perfect. I appreciate you joining me today. I'll have to have you back on as a guest. Maybe next time we could talk about the costs of poor quality. Oh yeah, yeah, because a lot of people know what you know quality costs money, because we have to have this training program, but they don't think about the cost of not having quality. What does it actually cost? Right, that's a whole other discussion.

Speaker 2: 36:55

It is a whole other discussion and I yeah. And when everybody talks about rework, everybody's like oh, yes, exactly, that's why it's important Got to learn how to do it right the first time.

Speaker 1: 37:06

Exactly right. Well, thank you for coming on today. I appreciate you being here today.

Speaker 2: 37:10

Thank you, Chuck. I hope you have a wonderful weekend.

Speaker 1: 37:12

You too.

Speaker 3: 37:18

Until next time. Everybody remember, knowledge is power. That's it for this episode of today's podcast. We hope you were able to learn something. Make sure to subscribe so you don't miss out on future content. Also, leave a rating so we can help even more people learn about telecommunications. Until next time, be safe.