Is Tribalism Holding You Back?

As a veteran of the communication technology industry, I've seen the trenches of tribalism firsthand. It's time to set aside the generational battle cries and union banners, and in this episode, I'm opening up about my journey through the maze of 'us versus them'..

Tonight's discussion ventures into the landscape of professional organizations like FOA and BICSI, dissecting their unique roles and how they can shape our careers. However, the true heartbeat of this episode lies in the pursuit of a united industry tribe where the low voltage buzz is about innovation, not division. I extend an invitation for all of us to reach across proverbial aisles, share ideas, and enrich our collective experience. And as we wrap up, I encourage you to connect, not just for the sake of knowledge but for building a stronger, more inclusive community where every voice can be heard. Goodnight, and stay safe.

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:00

Thursday night, 6 pm Eastern Standard Time. That can only mean one thing live after hours with Chuck Bowser, your favorite RCDD. Don't try to pretend like I'm not. Don't try to pretend like I'm not. I take your questions on structure, key link, copper and fiber, installation, certification, design, project management, estimation, even career path. But tonight's show is a little bit different. Tonight's show I'm shooting from the hip, speaking to you tonight from my heart.

Speaker 1: 0:58

This has been weighing on me for quite a while, quite a while. I've just finally got to the point where I just need to take a break from a regular type of content and just say this. I just need to say this. But before we do that acronym challenge, we got to do the acronym challenge, the acronym challenge. What does BCT stand for? What does BCT stands for? It's an acronym. I'll give you a hint. It has something to do with bonding and grounding. I'll give you that hint. What does BCT stand for? A lot of people get confused about bonding and grounding. It is a very complex subject in our industry, but in order to do it correctly, you got to follow the standards. In order for the cable plant to perform safely and not injure people and burn out equipment, you need to follow this one. So nobody gets it. I get it, it's a hard one. Bonding conductor for telecommunications. Bct is bonding conductor for telecommunications. It basically just means the conductor that goes from the ground ride to the primary bonding bus bar. That's all that really means.

Speaker 1: 2:14

So I wanted to get back to again something has been weighing on my heart, and you know, four years ago, when I started the whole podcast, I did it to educate people, I did it to encourage people, I did it to enrich people's lives. That's why the three tag lines of the podcast are educate, encourage and enrich. That's the whole reason. I do this Not just some of the people, not just the people in this group, not just the people who are union or non-union, not just the people who are FOA members or Bixie members. I do this for everybody, everybody.

Speaker 1: 2:54

But it's become blatantly obvious that, because of today's society, which has a vested interest in keeping us fighting each other, arguing against each other, it has proliferated into our industry as well. It has, it's absolutely gotten into our industry. Now, because of that, we started to see what's called tribalism. Ok, tribalism, and what is tribalism? It has its roots. It has its roots back into the days when people, human beings, men and women, would gather in groups and that group had a similar mindset and they would protect each other. They would grow each other's foods and if somebody would try to steal somebody's food or somebody from another tribe, these tribes would fight other tribes to protect themselves. And there was a time in human world where that was an absolute necessity. I'm going to fix that. There we go. That was an absolute necessity, but in today's modern environment it's creating divisiveness, it's stifling collaboration. You want a perfect example of it?

Speaker 1: 4:17

Look at the whole boomer versus millennial conversation. I'm a boomer, I get it. I get it and you know what Self-reflection here. I used to be that typical boomer. I used to be the person who would look at the other generations and I'm like you guys. You have it so easy. When I was growing up, we actually had to do the math. We had to do the math with a pen and paper. You guys have a calculator with you. You have it easy, you young whippersnappers. I had to walk uphill both ways in the snow.

Speaker 1: 4:55

But you know again, tribalism. I'm in the boomer tribe versus the millennial tribe and because of that, here's what tribalism does is it permeates your brain and it gives you the thought that other people aren't as good as you. Other people aren't as good as you and unfortunately that is not the case. It's absolutely not the case. And so we're diving ourselves into different tribes within our industry and what that's doing is it's stifling innovation, because you don't want to listen to that other group because oh well, a union guy came up with that. Oh, you don't want to do that way of testing fiber because that's the way FOA does it. That's not right. It's just absolutely not right. I'm sorry, you know, that's what tribalism does.

Speaker 1: 5:56

I had a conversation with a close friend not too long ago and they kind of said tribalism is you know, you know we're not communities, were tribes. And and I get it, I understand where that person was coming from. I'm telling you we need to do better than that. We need to do better than that because when you're in your own tribe, you're not sharing ideas, you're not sharing thoughts with other tribes. It's I've said this before and I'm not. People don't know, don't realize that I mean this. A Rising tide raises all boats, all boats Union boats, john Union boats, f O A boats, big see boats, low voltage, nation boats, tkw boats, blue Boomer boats, millennial boats. It benefits everybody. It benefits everybody's.

Speaker 1: 6:53

Now, on top of that, yeah, here's another one us versus them, us versus them. You'll see this a lot Management versus the people actually out in the field not realizing. You know, some people don't realize that the this is not all these the case, but not people don't realize it. Well, that person who's a manager now Might have come from the field and maybe they're just trying to Teach you away so you don't make the same mistakes that they did. Because you're stuck in your tribe, you're the field tribe. That's the management tribe Can't listen to them because they're all stupid idiots. They got college degrees. Well, college degree doesn't automatically make you smart, but that's the thing. And again, looking from the other side, management gets in that whole tribal sense.

Speaker 1: 7:43

All the man, these young kids nowadays All they want to do is just be on their phones. All they want to do is just, they just want to. They don't want to work, they want to be content creators. You know there's advantages to that. Maybe, as a manager, you should embrace that young person Person because you know what. Maybe they're gonna be really quick in finding out information because they can easily work a phone and know what, what search engines to use, what, what AI to use.

Speaker 1: 8:19

Maybe that young person might have a fresh way of looking at things, which might actually be better. You just there's an old saying out there. It says you know, just because that's the way your dad always did, it Doesn't mean that's the way you should do it. Look at our industry. Look at our industry. 40 years ago we weren't even installing Four-pair cable for data. We were installing coax Twinax, type one, type three, type nine. So the, the, the practices that we have gotten from putting in that kind of cable Might need to be revised. So that new person that, whatever Jen would have I don't even know all the generations, gen X, gen Y, gen Z, whatever they all are, I don't know but maybe that person, maybe you should listen to that person, because maybe they might have an idea. And Because we don't do that, we're creating a lot of workplace tension, a pretty toxic culture.

Speaker 1: 9:20

And and what does that really do? Number one it makes people stressed out, makes people not want to go to work when they're there. It makes them not want to give their 100% Right. Let me know if any of this resonates with you. Or is this just me? Is this just me or does the? Is some of this message actually resonating with you?

Speaker 1: 9:42

Another thing that this whole tribalism is going to do is is it's going to hinder your professional development, it's gonna hinder the industry progress. Right, because of the way, because, because I said, because you're, you're a, let me pick one, because I don't want to pick on any, every, every organization, every Group is guilty of this. When I want to list out these names, I'm not saying that these are, these are just ones that come off top of my head. Okay, so let's say, for example, let's just take the union versus non-union and if you've listened to my show before, you know I am a proponent of both. There are great union people, there are great non-union people. There are poor non-union people. There are poor union people. Okay, it's just, it is what it is.

Speaker 1: 10:39

So when you, when you're, when you, if you put people in your, in these, in these different tribe, oh they're the union tribe, the non-union tribe. And you, and because, let's say, the, the, the union guy, who might be a journeyman electrician and a technician, might come to you with an idea on how to do something, because they're they're applying all of their experiences from Low voltage, maybe you know, doing regular electrical work and their whole background things, that their lifespan, their experiences. They might be able to make something easy, a few, but if you're in, you're stuck in your own tribe and you're not listening to what the other person because they're not in your tribe You're You're hurting yourself, I, you're absolutely hurting yourself and you know this. As I said, this is making me sad. I mean, it's maybe sad, it's not the right word, but it's. Maybe I'm just becoming more aware. Maybe it was always like this. Maybe I'm just now, because I'm getting older, I'm starting to pay attention to words and people. Maybe I'm just becoming more aware of it. Right, so you know, it's again because we're putting ourselves into tribes. It's. It's going to stifle your career growth because you don't want to listen. That you know. You know the person who. They went to college and then they became a PM and maybe you know they. Maybe they think you, you should take the same path as them. Well, maybe not. Maybe your path is different. I know a lot of people who some of the most successful people in the business world do not have college degrees. Again, there's another tribe for you College degrees, non college degrees. Which is better? Neither. There are great people who have college degrees. There are great people who don't have college degrees. There are poor people who have college degree. I want to say poor, I mean bad they're. When I say bad, I don't mean like criminal bad. I mean I mean they just not good for the industry. And there's, there's poor examples of people who don't have college degrees. Right, again, it's us versus them. It's a whole tribal thing, the whole tribal thing. And because you're in your own tribe, you don't want to listen to other people's ideas. And you know what. This is not just you versus them impact. This is not your workplace, this is also impacting the industry. The industry because we're putting ourselves into tribes, putting ourselves into tribes, and that's the worst thing you can do.

Speaker 1: 13:18

Let's talk, let's give you some real life examples that I've noticed or that I've been paying attention to. I've already mentioned the union versus non union disputes. There was actually a Facebook post. I think it was today, I think it was this morning, might have been yesterday morning, I'm not really sure. I have to go back and look at it, but somebody and I'll give you the synopsis of it because I don't remember exactly how it was worded, but somebody had posted hey, I'm thinking about joining the union, can you give me some ideas? The very first response was absolutely fantastic and, by the way, this is actually on Louisville Dignations Facebook group, right, and that's another example we're talking about here in a little bit too. And the first, the first response is absolutely fantastic because he said look, I have been both. I've been a union member and a non union member. Here's the benefits for being a union member, here's the benefits for non union, here's the drawbacks for being union, here's the drawbacks for being non union. Because it really boils down to what works best for you, your career path and your family, because the decision I make may not be the decision that somebody else would make, of course, not. A lot of posts after that were a whole bunch of toxic tribalism posts. Oh well, you know, union this, you're on union that, right. That's. That's just one of them. That's just one of them.

Speaker 1: 14:42

Another one, another one is the whole FOA versus Bixie, fiber optic association versus Bixie, if you don't know who these two organizations are. So they're both professional organizations in the communication technology industry. They're both great organizations. They both have very similar goals. They're both. They both have great people working for them. They both have great people leading those organizations. They're similar but they're not quite the same. Okay, they're not quite the same.

Speaker 1: 15:21

I can get asked all the time which? Which career path should I take, should I? I want to become, I want to do this. That usually when I get those kinds of questions, I usually say call me, let's talk about this guy, let's talk about this guy. I'm going to take the big, big, big question. I'm going to take the big question and get it. But I think the question is it's going to be more information, because sometimes I might recommend you to go to the FA FOA route, sometimes I might recommend you to go to the big C route. It just kind of depends. I'm going to listen to your story, to your needs and to figure out. Okay, I feel that this is your best path.

Speaker 1: 15:57

F? Oa is not better than Bixie in the FOA tribe talking down about the Bixie people. It's not right. It's not right. And part of that is because maybe some of the leaders aren't holding their people accountable. Maybe that's part of the problem.

Speaker 1: 16:22

Again, they're both great organizations and I feel that they are complementary to each other. They're not exclusive of each other. And some might say, well, they're competitors. Well, maybe we need to rethink their whole competitor thing. That's where TKW gets this right. They're community over competition. That's another one TKW versus low voltage nation, both great organizations. I know both organizations very well, I operate in both of them, I know the leaders of both of them and I know everybody in both organizations, because the low voltage nation is like 50, 60, 100,000 people, so there's no way I can know all of them, but I know a lot of them and I'm telling you those are both great organizations. Again, they are similar to each other but they're not quite the same. They're not. They're both great organizations. They both have great people volunteering in both of these organizations. They both have some people in those organizations that sometimes are affected by tribalism. They're affected by tribalism.

Speaker 1: 17:34

The table is big enough for everybody. It truly is. It truly is big enough for both union and versus non-union, foa versus big C, low voltage nation versus TKW, boomers versus millennial, college versus non-college. There's enough room at the table for everybody. We need to be open, open mind. A brain is like a parachute it only functions when it's open. If you don't have an open mind and you don't listen to other people who might be of another tribe. It's not their loss. It's not their loss, it's your loss. It's your loss because you might miss out on getting a relationship with a future business partner, a future customer, a future best friend. It's your fault because you're so stuck in your stupid tribe that you don't want to listen to the thoughts and the knowledge and things that other people try. It's really, really, really affecting our industry. It truly is.

Speaker 1: 18:49

Let's talk about some strategies. I thought about this over the last couple of days. Some strategies. I'm just going to throw these out there. I'm going to throw it and see what sticks to the wall. What can we do to help break down these tribes? I want to create a new tribe. I want to create a new tribe.

Speaker 1: 19:09

The low voltage industry is the tribe. We get rid of all these other sub-tribes. We get rid of these sub-tribes. The first thing is facilitate open dialogue. It's funny we work in the communications industry.

Speaker 1: 19:28

What do we suck at? Communicating, communicating. I get it. I totally get it. I used to be this way too. I've said it on many episodes before. Look at me now and they see that I have no problems, striking up conversations with people and stuff like that. That is from 40 years of experience. There was a good 20 years, 25 years, where I'm talking about tribalism, kat, and how it's negative to our industry. There's a good 20, 25 years where I didn't talk to anybody because I didn't know how to communicate. I wasn't good at communicating.

Speaker 1: 20:11

One of the biggest steps that you can do to break down the walls of the tribes the us versus them, the union versus non-union, the FOA versus Bixie Kat. How about the CCNA versus I don't know, I'm not good with technology. I guarantee you here's one that Kat might recognize. How about Mac versus PC? There's another two tribes for you.

Speaker 1: 20:39

Again, how many times have you heard somebody say something negative to somebody because they bought an iPhone or they bought an Android, because they're firmly in their tribes? Guess what? I have both. I have both. I have both an iPhone and an Android. That's not because I'm rich, it's because my company work, my day job, is an Android. My personal phone's an iPhone. Again, they are both great devices. In some functions my iPhone is better. Some functions my company's Android is better. When you start talking down about another somebody because they're in the Android tribe, that causes pain, suffering, poor communications. It helps, makes people feel bad about themselves. Another way to help break down these walls of tribalism that we have in our industry I've already touched base on it Embrace diversity of thought.

Speaker 1: 21:44

Embrace diversity of thought. I know we're getting beat over the head in today's public environment. Diversity, inclusion, all that stuff. Listen to what I'm saying. Diversity of thought Pay attention, because, first off, give value to somebody else's opinion, because realize that their opinion, their viewpoint, is based on their experiences and their training. Your opinion is going to be based on your experiences and your training. Embrace what they're saying. I'm not necessarily saying you have to agree with it, but at least listen to it again with the open mind. Open mind the parachute only functions when it's open. Your brain only works when it's open. Listen to the opinions of other people. Here's a thought Not only listen to them, try to see their viewpoint through their eyes, because you know what. They might have a better idea, they might have a better widget. Again, if you're so firmly stuck in your camp because you're bigsy and they're FOA, and you don't want to listen to them because they're FOA, you are going to be the one who doesn't get the benefit from that. So, diversity of thought, and that goes both ways.

Speaker 1: 23:10

Again, don't rule out that person just because he has gray hair. Don't rule out that person just because they have purple hair right, look past that. Look past that. Also, how about exploring a way to cultivate a culture of mutual respect? Again, understand that. Well, maybe that person again going back to the college tribe versus the non-college tribe understand that maybe that person was their whole entire life that was driven to their head by their parents. There's another one right there Single family homes versus kids who grew up with two other tribes. Understand that their path is going to be different than you and understand that. Maybe have some empathy for that path. Understand that. Discuss the roles of leadership and modeling respectful behavior.

Speaker 1: 24:13

Make sure that you foster inclusivity. Foster inclusivity. Understand that just because somebody has a different opinion than you, because they're in a different tribe than you, again, they're management and you're the guy out in the field. Field versus management. Two other tribes, right, two other tribes. Understand that when you, I almost said a bad word. I'm fired up tonight if you can't figure that out right now, because this has been weighing on me for so long, because I see the negativity coming from everywhere and if we just take that same energy that we put towards negativity and put it towards false, put it towards fostering a culture of mutual respect, understand that their opinion is going to be different than yours. Still, listen to it, try to see it through their eyes. There have been times in my life where I have been in a different place, where I've listened to somebody else's opinion and it has changed my opinion Because I looked at it through their eyes. I looked at it through their eyes Again, talking strictly about our industry, our industry, right.

Speaker 1: 25:35

Another Another one we can do is how about cross collaborations? Now, this really, specifically, is going to be for, like, maybe FOA versus Bixie, tkw versus Low Voltage Nation Collaborate with each other, because when we stop communicating with each other, bad things happen. We've got to communicate with each other. We've got to communicate with each other, and collaboration helps break down those walls. It helps break down those tribal boundaries. And here's the other thing, my last strategy to overcome tribalism and industry, and this one falls squarely on top of the shoulders of the leaders the leaders of Bixie, the leaders of FOA, the leaders of the unions, the leaders of TKW, the leaders of Low Voltage Nation, the leaders of the companies. This is squarely to you.

Speaker 1: 26:38

Okay, make sure that it's part of your servant leadership. If you know what servant leadership is, look it up. I mean, in fact, I just did an interview last week with AK and we talked about servant leadership Right as part of your leadership. Make sure that you set the tone for inclusive and collaborative behavior.

Speaker 1: 27:03

If you see somebody and if you see somebody posing something in a low voltage community and it doesn't foster collaborative, positive reinforcement, you, as the leader of that organization, need to address that. You need to lead by example. You need to. When you see it, you need to fix it and you also need to set the example as the leader of your organization. Just because another tribe might have said something you don't agree with, or a member of a tribe of another organization said something you didn't agree with, that doesn't mean you, as the leader, can go out and pose something to attack that other group. We are better than that in our industry. Better than that. You need to provide the example of what you expect from the people whom you lead, whom you peers, whom you work with. So, like I said, tribalism is affecting us as an industry. It's affecting our companies, it's affecting our communities, it's affecting our professional organizations and we need to strip down those walls of the tribes. We need to get back to a point of respect towards each other.

Speaker 1: 28:33

Here's my call to action for everybody tonight who's listening to this. I'm hoping I'm resonating. I truly am, because I can't be the only person in Jesus. Let me know if this is resonating with you. Encourage again this is a call to action for you Encourage anybody within whom you think is in your tribe again and I'm listening a half a dozen tribes tonight in our industry. Encourage them to reflect on their experiences and consider maybe new ways that they can go outside their comfort zone and have conversations with people in other tribes.

Speaker 1: 29:17

But that's what Bigsy calls it here at FOA. We call it that you know what, who cares. We don't really both know what it means. Also, I also invite you to discuss and collaborate and overcome these tribal barriers within our industry. So if you're a union person, reach out to a non-union person. If you're at low voltage, low voltage nation, reach out to TKW. If you are a management and you got the field, reach out and have those conversations. Have those conversations.

Speaker 1: 29:54

I hope I didn't bring everybody down the night. I truly don't, because I don't know. It has been weighing on me. It has absolutely been weighing on me and I don't know why I've been struck by it. And let's just look at some of the comments before we click off.

Speaker 1: 30:12

Jim Parsons in the house hey Jim, how you doing? I think the biggest thing I think is between boomers and young ones are soft skills. There's a lot of, there's a lot of the tons of high defined soft skills. There's some soft skills that young people have that low people don't have, and vice versa. Anthony Romeo is in the house, a fellow member on the big cementering committee. He says there are currently four generations working in the workforce. Each generation has their own way of getting things done. Stay open minded because each generation has their benefits. Absolutely Spot on, spot on, anthony. I'm so glad to have you as a friend. I truly am.

Speaker 1: 30:57

Jim says after full career construction, old timers are usually crass and rather hostile at times. You know why and I can say this because I am an old person. Sometimes I'm tired, sometimes I'm my wife and I get into this. She loves to learn things. We'll be out working on something, and if I'm working on something and I'm blowing, I'm going and I'm running into an issue. The wrong time to talk to me about something is when I'm having a problem trying to figure out a problem in my head on something I'm doing with my hands. Give me time. So it's not all people can be crass. Absolutely. And again, as a call to action, maybe as an old person, maybe maybe just be a little more open. Okay, and Anthony says it has always been done that way as a mentality is a death trap. Absolutely, absolutely, absolutely. Okay.

Speaker 1: 31:52

Anthony brought up another good tribe, one Toyota versus GM. There you go, yes, and again, there's advantages that you know. They're both good cars, right, all right. So we are actually a little bit past our thing here tonight. So I I hopefully, I hope that and usually talk technology stuff and copper cable, voice cable and career pass up. Tonight was totally off the wall from the hips. It's been weighing on my heart and I had to get it off because I'm so tired of seeing us fight. Break down the walls of your tribe, reach out to somebody in another tribe because I guarantee you you will benefit from it. You will learn from it because, remember, one of the pillars of my podcast is knowledge is power. Thank you everybody for for putting up with my rant tonight, and if this resonates with you, please let me know, because I want to know if I'm plugged in or if I'm just totally left field. Thank you everybody, and have a good night.

Speaker 2: 33:01

That's it for this episode of today's podcast. We hope you were able to learn something. Make sure to subscribe so you don't miss out on future content. Also, leave a rating so we can help even more people learn about telecommunications. Until next time, be safe.